The questionable value of lists

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Timnic54

NWBIG
Horologist
Jan 16, 2018
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The Questionable Value of Lists




Don't follow lists.

Read the facts and make up your own mind. The opinion which matters most is yours and to form it you will be better off going directly to the source, short cuts will only misdirect. Read the reviews, look at the tear downs learn and understand from the objective opinions of some of the experts on HB. I won't name them, because as with all information it is of greater value if you seek it yourself

Some time ago I started a thread "Not worth Buying in Gen " The purpose of this thread was to allude to the possibility that certain watches, by virtue of the quality Reps available, were simply not, in Gen form, offering a significant enough benefit over the available Rep.
At the same time I wanted to coin the phrase and acronym NWBIG.

Since creating that thread and since spending some considerable time on Highly valuable resources such as this. I am driven more and more towards the view that lists of watches be them NWBIG or Super Rep lists are very likely counter productive to assisting the buyer, newbie or otherwise.

The reason I am thinking this way is that although such lists always start well they always fall foul eventually of opinion corruption.
Opinions are everywhere, almost everyone has one. The problem is the opinions are not always very well considered and are often prejudicially motivated by various personal agendas.

When one is searching information and reading individual opinions and reviews, it is relatively easy to ascertain and separate over enthusiasm and subjective opinion from clear factual analysis and objective criticism.

However when these opinions are collectively amassed to form a list of watches we should all be buying, much of the detail is lost and the shape of the opinion becomes distorted, sometimes even a single fact which can be massively significant to the opinion is lost

For example;

Through this list process one might perceive that a great "Super rep" is JF AP Diver v7/8 However without considerable attention to detail one might easily miss the fact that this is only true in the closed back version.

One might equally , through such lists be tempted towards the view that The Noob Rhodium Dial Yachtmaster with As3135 is an excellent Rep, one might then be drawn towards the view that perhaps the AS 3135 is potentially unreliable, and will therefore go for the ETA engined version without realising that in most other ways it is a completely different watch. The dial and hands is alternatively sourced to suit the movement.

By reading directly the information in the threads and avoiding the temptation to use short cut lists, however noble the intentions of the list creators, the buyer is much more likely, albeit with some effort on his part, to actually come up with a satisfying and not disappointing purchase.
 
Last edited:

TinaTime

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2018
78
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Very good points, but I do think there may be something to the wisdom of crowds theory. The book, The Wisdom of Crowds: Why the Many Are Smarter Than the Few , holds that a diverse collection of independently deciding individuals is likely to make certain types of decisions and arrive at conclusions better than individuals or even experts. The key here is the difference between herd mentality and collecting the opinion of independently deciding individuals.

Here’s one example in the book to illustrate the point. The crowd at a county fair accurately determined the weight of an ox when their individual estimates were averaged even though no one individual had guessed the correct weight.

I think your NWBIG idea is an example of trying to average the opinions of independently deciding individuals to arrive at a better conclusion than one individual could achieve on their own. I really like the idea of the list and hope the community keeps it going. If nothing else it’s a fabulous starting point for many of us.
 

PlanetZoom

Active Enthusiast
Ambassador
Jan 20, 2018
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One might equally , through such lists be tempted towards the view that The Noob Rhodium Dial Yachtmaster with As3135 is an excellent Rep, one might then be drawn towards the view that perhaps the AS 3135 is potentially unreliable, and will therefore go for the ETA engined version without realising that in most other ways it is a completely different watch. The dial and hands is alternatively sourced to suit the movement.
@Timnic54, do you by any chance have photos comparing the two?

Puretime appears to be using the same watch for both models:
https://puretime05.com/watch-brands/rolex/yacht-master/yacht-master-116622-noob-best-edition-2016-baselworld-gray-dial-on-ss-bracelet-sa3135.html
https://puretime05.com/watch-brands/rolex/yacht-master/yacht-master-116622-noob-best-edition-2016-baselworld-gray-dial-on-ss-bracelet-a2836.html
 
OP
Timnic54

Timnic54

NWBIG
Horologist
Jan 16, 2018
1,117
1,747
163
Bangkok
I don't have photos sorry. But the hands are different as the Cannon pinions on those two movements will not take the same hands. Also the case has to be different as the crown stem position on a 2836 is not the same as a 3135.

In fact if you look closely at the hand centers on the two links you posted you will see that the hand center size is correct on the 3135 and incorrect on the 2836.
 

PlanetZoom

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Jan 20, 2018
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Thank you for answering so quickly.

Yeah, I thought that looked a bit different but wasn't sure if it was lighting/angle.
 

Havitetty

WTB: TC v7x LN or LV
Mar 10, 2018
136
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28
@Timnic54 , your thread is what helped guide me since August when I joined RWI.

The thought and effort that you put into it helped me make my first purchase, the JF V7 Diver. You gave me a starting point that helped me learn!
 
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Timnic54

Timnic54

NWBIG
Horologist
Jan 16, 2018
1,117
1,747
163
Bangkok
@Timnic54 , your thread is what helped guide me since August when I joined RWI.

The thought and effort that you put into it helped me make my first purchase, the JF V7 Diver. You gave me a starting point that helped me learn!
The JF AP V7 is a truly great Rep. I am very happy to have played a small part in your decision. This is a great brotherhood and a great hobby. I hope you continue to enjoy it for many years to come.
 
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